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Announcement :: Organizing
Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
Will Speak-out on the Death of More Than 2,000 US Soldiers and the Scooter Libby Indictment and Resignation
Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
Will Speak-out on the Death of More Than 2,000 US Soldiers and the Scooter Libby Indictment and Resignation

Cindy Sheehan's Schedule for Saturday, October 29th

10:30 AM Press Conference
Unitarian Universalist Association, 25 Beacon St., Boston, MA
2nd Flr., Eliot Hall (“The Chapel”)

11:00 AM Rally
The Boston Common at the Bandstand in Boston

12:30 PM March Steps-off
Past the State House and Federal Building and back to the Common
for Concluding Rally at 1:30 PM

3:00 PM Receive Courage of Conscious Award from the Peace Abbey
Two North Main Street, Sherborn, MA 01770

BOSTON -- Cindy Sheehan, indy Sheehan, the grieving military mother whose August vigil outside President Bush's ranch in Crawford, Texas, focused the nation's attention on the human cost of the Iraq war, will be in Boston on Saturday, October 29th and will hold a press conference at 10:30 AM to call for the immediate withdrawal of US troops from Iraq. The event will be held at the Unitarian Universalist Association, right next to the State House, at 25 Beacon St., 2nd Flr., in historic Eliot Hall. Boston City Councilor Félix Arroyo has also been invited to speak.

Following the press conference, Sheehan will be the keynote speaker at a large March and Rally to Bring Troops Home Now from the Iraq Occupation—starting with a first Rally at 11 a.m. on the Boston Common at the Bandstand. The March will proceed at 12:30 p.m. past the State House and Federal Building before returning to the Common where a concluding Rally will be held with speakers representing a variety of anti-war positions. Rain or shine.

“This has been a heart-breaking week,” Sheehan said. “2,012 US soldiers have lost their lives in a war whose justifications have proven to be false, and the President still refuses to acknowledge that the war was a tragic mistake for Iraq and also for the United States.”

“But I take hope from the fact that people throughout this country know that what's happening is wrong and spoke out at more than a 1,000 vigils and marches and anti-war protests this week to honor the now 2,012 US lives lost in Iraq and call for the troops to be brought home now.”

''While the indictment and resignation of Lewis 'Scooter' Libby is a
welcome development, the responsibility for lying to the American
people and targeting critics and dissidents needs to go all the way
up the chain of command. Scooter Libby was clearly one of the
administration's attack dogs unleashed on opponents of this fraudulent
war, but he serves higher masters," said Sheehan.

"This administration continues to wage a war based on lies, a war that has taken the lives of 2,012
Americans to date, including my son, and the lives of tens of thousands of
innocent Iraqis. This indictment reinforces the growing calls in this
country and around the world to end the occupation, bring our troops
home and hold those responsible accountable for their crimes.
Let this serve as a springboard to put the warmakers on trial and bring our
troops home now.''

This week Sheehan held a week-long vigil in Lafayette Park across from the White House to be a daily, visual reminder to those who live and work in the White House of the strong opposition to the Iraq war and the anger of the nation at the more than 2,000 US lives that have been lost in Iraq. Her protest was among more than 1,000 protests throughout the country that were held this week to honor the US soldiers whose lives were lost in Iraq and call for the troops to be brought home now.

Wednesday night, Sheehan and two-dozen other peace activists, including Gold Star father Juan Torres and former US diplomat Ann Wright, were arrested in an act of nonviolent civil disobedience after they participated in a symbolic “die in” in front of the White House.

According to the Iraq Body Count project, between 26,732 and 30,098 Iraqis have been killed since the invasion in March 2003. A study published in the prestigious medical journal, The Lancet, put the number at 100,000. A study by the Associated Press revealed that at least 3,870 Iraqis were killed in the last six months alone.

Since the summer of 2005, polls have consistently shown that a major of Americans oppose the war in Iraq, think it’s unwinnable, believe it makes us less safe at home and want a timetable for troop withdrawal. Iraqis also want the US to leave. A national survey conducted in August by an Iraqi university research team for the British Ministry of Defense found 82 percent of Iraqis "strongly opposed" to the presence of coalition troops; less than one per cent of the population believes coalition forces are responsible for any improvement in security, and 67 per cent of Iraqis feel less secure because of the occupation.
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Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
another long morning of speakers, preaching to the choir. no wonder we cant change anything.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
what a couple of sad sack responses. . .

bashing Cindy. . .

and militant 3000 person rally, with full media coverage is preaching to the choir?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
Woot! Go Cindy! Yay for free speech and vocal anti-war sentiment! Hope we can keep it....
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
Whose streets? Our Streets ! Whose Streets? Our Streets ?.... Hey it's snowing. Ok, let's gome home.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
Whose streets? Our Streets ! Whose Streets? Our Streets ?.... Hey it's snowing. Ok, let's gome home.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
The best thing for the Iraqi people is for us to simply leave and admit failure. Saddam has not yet been tried so we simply declare a mistrial and say we're sorry. At least Saddam was able to keep control of the country. If we let him go and restore him to power he will be our best ally in the middle east. He really didn't do us any harm and his people seem to want him back in power, so why not?
"militant 3000 person rally"
29 Oct 2005
what? where? when?? wtf are you talking about? this rally has not been called or advertised as anything radical and there is certainly no guarantee there will be 3000 people there.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
earlier today. minus the "militant"
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
the march was great! the police looked so silly with GW and the missile dick chicks marching allong behind them, hee hee hee!

the tremont temple doorway was so full of cops, they were lucky there wasnt any emergency, it was a brick wall of cops, whew!
very fun fun fun march, and I was proud to see so damn many people stay out and stick it out for so many hours - of course it dwindled down - but then, the reall reason to gather was to March
good going folks. next?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
29 Oct 2005
that handful of Harvard right-wingers at the rally has clearly rushed home and put their sticky fingers to laptop keys to post on BIMC. . .what's hilarious is that one of them showed up on TV reportage about the rally actually sputtering about the U.S. fighting "terrorists" in Iraq as if that had not been thoroughly debunked even before the illegal U.S. invasion. . .
Cindy Sheehan in Boston Oct29 - images from Today
29 Oct 2005
http://news.yahoo.com/photos/ss/events/iraq/082701iraqplane/im:/051029/480/malp10310292130;_ylt=AtRjMwuRnNGf3yoXKpPcL.hsaMYA;_ylu=X3oDMTA5bGcyMWMzBHNlYwNzc25hdg--
a display at the rally today - RIP.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/051029/480/malp10410292134
Cindy spoke well today, Oct 29th. THANK YOU CINDY. and EVERONE WHO TURNED OUT DISPITE THE SNOW!!
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
3000 people? yea right.
Images from Boston Common Oct29th rally
30 Oct 2005
capt.malp10410292134.anti_war_rally_malp104.jpg
capt.malp10310292130.anti_war_rally_malp103.jpg
capt.malp10210292122.anti_war_rally_malp102.jpg
here's Cindy and the quite sizable crowd before the march and before the snow.
#file_1#

Heres a display for local dead created by a mourning father- RIP, kid.
#file_2#

Here's a local protesting another local
#file_3#

The day was good, and challenging only 11 or so turned out pro-army, plus some 8 Nazis we recognised from the last time they rallied.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
Yeah, I know who the guy with the bullhorn was. He works with answer (or the international action center) and he was on stage talking about his union. I think his name is Steve.

For people who don't know, the ANSWER/IAC truck kept trying to drive through people holding an anarchist banner. Bryan G. Pfeifer, who often posts articles on this website, was at the front of the truck yelling at people to get out of the way while waving the truck on into a crowd of students, many of them anarchists. Earlier in the march, the man with the bullhorn (Steve?) tried to cut off the Youth Bloc, which was at the front of the march. They would stop their truck as the Youth Bloc continued marching, and as he put it, the Youth Bloc and other people in front of the ANSWER/IAC truck could either keep marching and have their own march, or they could get behind the truck.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
you gotta be kidding me. There were nowhere near 3000, and at least 1/3 of the people left before the speakers even stopped blabbing. When you say "March at 11," DONT FUCKING LIE and start at 2:30. We are sick of hearing sectarians plug their little groups. We are all already against the war, thats why we do to anti-war marches. And yes, it is preaching to the choir, regardless of if the media is there. They know people cant stand to watch hours apon hours of speaches, its what they have soundclips for. And plus, 3000 people actively taking the streets and doing whatever else they will while they have them looks a lot better on camera than 3000 people sitting around, passively listening. (and anyway, whats the corporate media going to do for the anti-corporate-war movement?). The war is still going on, dont we have better things to do with our time than just listening? We need real dialouge, and we need action (AND not just marching, either),
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
pardon me, i meant march at 12:30
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
well it was supposed to start at 11, then we got there and they told us 12:30, but it ended up being around 1 anyway.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
i have nothing against the unions, and i have nothing against multi-racial folks, but i DO have a problem with stalinist fascist pigs driving a truck into me and my friends and playing music that doesn't even make any sense with what we were saying. i have a problem when that fucking ANSWER truck shows up to any sizable rally and takes the fucking thing over. i have a problem when they shout at us and stop the fucking march so their precious banner can be in front and i have a problem when some prick with a bull horn, union or not, shouts at me because i am in front of their goddamn banner, which no one but us would read any way because the pigs brought us along deserted streets so no one would see us and the liberals and the stalinists went along with it. that is when i have a problem.

and fuck you brezhnev. just because some anarchists are stupid rich kids doesn't mean we all are. and just cause they planned the event doesn't mean they have complete authority over us, and it doesn't mean they have to go along with the police.
more images from the rally
30 Oct 2005
Here's a link to my images from the rally on Flickr:
http://flickr.com/photos/nic221/sets/1240249/
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
I totally aree the marching is way more effective than the speeches. While I think all of the sectarian speeches were all worthwhile, I don't think they belonged at the protest (they took up SO much time). I was marching with the Youth Bloc and I am really pissed that ANSWER and the truck behind us refused to march with us until THEY were in front. Its not important to me who's inf ront- the thing that makes me mad is that it made us look like a bunch of divided punks when we should have been united. Stupid. Next time we need a bigger turnout, a longer route, a shorter rally, and more involvement from the public in general (not just the extreme left wing folks who show up at all of these events). Any ideas as to how we can change things other than marches? I feel that we're just verifying our own view and not relaly convincing others. By the way, does anyone know how many people there REALLY were at the rally? And were the police there to control us, or were they protecting us too? Anways, we need to work on stuff, but I'm still glad I came to the march. It's important to have a mix of radicals AND moderates (or at least friendly looking people) and a mix of races, sexes, ages, and cultures. When's the next march gonna be?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
it was a fantastic effort to be sure- and despite the conflicts listed here, i was pleased to see that there was very much LESS infighting(except, of course, with the nazis, who marched with the right wing red and white and blue folks, haw haw haw assholes)-- i didnt' get down there until the march started. . . . . .but i did notice(and this is not to put anyone down, mind you)- but i did kind of maybe notice that i knew most of the peopel i saw there- that they are the same people i see at all the marches. it fantastic and good taht there are so many people dedicated to marching against this stuff- but how can we- or rather all the various WE-S- involve more people, who perhaps have not marched or activated much before, but are are really unhappy with the state of things?

also, i was wondering-- we have speakers at marches. what if we had workshops, kind of a-la social forum? people could form, i don't know, groups on teh grass or something to brainstorm and discuss different issues and strtegies- and each group would have astructure, say, without a leader or with- but to have inclusive discussion and come back after a given amoutn of time with a contact list and a plan for things to do between marche-s actions, correspondance, further meetings of minds. . . . . whatever each group does. . . . . . . well its just an idea- it coudl be a kind of instant free school. . . . . . . . .
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
and! much thanks to anyone who works on anything to make the world suck less- including teh peopel who organized this march- makes it less difficult to imagine there migth be some sort of future. . . . .
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
on the schedule: the rally was always at 11, the march was always to start at 12:30. . .and yes, it ran 30 minutes late--not too bad considering. . .

on the sound truck: IAC was always part of the planning coalition from the get-go, and their soundtruck was always supposed to lead the march--everyone has had some problems with them now and then over the years, but they did not do anything wrong or uncomradely yesterday; so accusing them of such is silly. . .
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
You little punks from wellesley ar pathetic. You were invited to be part of the coalition, you declined. You were invited to speak from the stage, you declined. So, when you you try and disrupt the march with one of your cop moves you whine and red-bait because you weren't able to pull it off.

Makes one wonder whose side you are really on.
YES
30 Oct 2005
I think the IAC did a great job of building for the rally and were very helpful with their sound truck.

Also the contributions from Steve Kirschbaum and LeiLani Dowell from the platform were some of the best of the event.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
It is clear to me that some of the most recent comments on this thread are directed toward the youth bloc and the Radical Youth Alliance in particular. It is also obvious that some of the comments are directed at me personally.

I am that "punk" from Wellesley, the one who helped organize the youth bloc. The group that called for the youth bloc, the Radical Youth Alliance, which I am also a part of, endorsed the rally. I personally was part of the planning process for this protest- not only attending meetings but passing out flyers. We were not, in fact, invited to speak from the stage. Instead we were told shortly before the protest was to take place that we were expected to speak, and we wouldn't have even known that were it not for a friend of mine in the coalition.

There have been many complaints that this rally (like the others) was just the same old people. That's what made the youth bloc important- we mobilized people from over 20 schools, many of whom have not previously been involved. While many peace groups sit and talk about counter recruitment, we are shutting down recruitment centers and working to kick recruiters off our campuses. We are working in our schools and in our communities with people who wouldn’t otherwise be involved.
As to the "multi-racial friends" comment- don't forget that many organizations of people of color refused to take part in this protest because of the attitude/tactics of the organizers.

To ANSWER and the IAC directly- over the years you've gotten really good at writing manifestos and flyers, at passing out those flyers and getting the regular crowd to come to protests. You are also extremely talented at alienating not only the public, but also fellow activists. The problem with the Youth Bloc wasn't that we wanted to be in front, because when we realized why you were trying to cut us off from the march (so that you could be in front) we let you pass. The problem was that rather than communicating your problems to those of us in the bloc, you instead took it upon yourself to separate us from the rest of the march. Your organization is extremely authoritarian, condescending, and alienating. While we were marching as united youth- across race, class, gender, and political boundaries- you were more concerned with dominating the march, whether that be with your sound trucks or writing your group’s name on all your signs. This attitude has been a theme in my experiences with ANSWER/IAC. Two summers ago I got to know a handful of you very closely, as I was misguided enough to volunteer for your organization. While I was there, one of the people I worked with continually tried to get me to read Leninist and Stalinist literature. Multiple people in the group continually trash-talked anarchists as “uneducated punks”, as you have done again in this thread. Just because people disagree with you does not mean we are uneducated. This elitist attitude is one of the many reasons that ANSWER/IAC should not be worked with. Another important reason is your authoritarian attitude. Y'all are not in charge of the movement, and just because you are older than some of us does not mean that you can tell us what to do. You were part of planning this protest, as were we. While you are devising new front groups to get people involved with your organization, youth groups like the Radical Youth Alliance and the many other groups marching in the Youth Bloc are working to kick recruiters out of our schools, we are holding workshops and discussions, and we are empowering ourselves in a society that wishes to keep us powerless (and with ageist attitudes from "peace veterans" like the IAC, the status quo is maintained).

There is lots of talk about how we need unity on the “left” or in the antiwar movement, and with good reason. But I refuse to work with people who are going to not only try to cut us off, but also try to run over other people with their truck. You are the bullies of the movement, telling us what to do and how to think, and when we don’t agree with you or get out of your way, you will literally try to run us over. But we will not be deterred and we will not submit.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
The best thing for the Iraqi people is for us to simply leave and admit failure. Saddam has not yet been tried so we simply declare a mistrial and say we're sorry. At least Saddam was able to keep control of the country. If we let him go and restore him to power he will be our best ally in the middle east. He really didn't do us any harm and his people seem to want him back in power, so why not?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
The Radical Youth Alliance was founded by three students, one of which is a person of color, and there are numerous people of color in our group and there were in the youth bloc. I would say that there is more racial diversity in the Radical Youth Alliance (percentage wise) than there was at the entire protest, though we obviously need to continue examining the issue of race and how racism plays out, because we realize that we are all indoctrinated with racist beliefs. But what do you have to say about the other things I said? What about the class diversity or the diversity of beliefs? The IAC certainly can't claim to have people of many various beliefs- maybe they have some Marxists, some Leninists, and some Stalinists and Maoists, but what about people who aren't socialists or communists?
The RYA is not an anarchist group, though some of the participants are. Unlike the IAC, we do not endorse candidates or political parties, and we accept all radicals, not just people with identical beliefs.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
Christ-Allah-Buddah-Goddess-Almighty! You folks need to give it a rest! Not only are the trolls out in force on this "discussion", but the folks finger-pointing and name-calling who aren't necessicarily trolls are making it too difficult to distinguish real conversation from the SMITE of leftist intellectual bashing. Does anyone have a reportback from this protest that doesn't involve bitching about the IAC/Answer of the Youth Block? I for one would love to hear about what Cindy spoke of, or what types of focus the people who attended were there to focus on? Were there Veterans for Peace present? Were the Raging Grannies there? Was there music or info booths for people to learn more about how to get invovled in anti-war protests in their communities?

Stop giving the trolls stuff to feed off of and post some info about the rally - that IS what this topic was sposed to be about in the first place, right?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
30 Oct 2005
the marching jazz band was terrific, fun bike block (even if there were only a handful of us), i really like converging with the protesters outside the focus on the family conference. I wish the march started earlier.
IAC RULES
31 Oct 2005
The International Action Center is on the cutting edge of anti-imperialism in he USA!

Brezhnev was a revisionist!
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
31 Oct 2005
While I thought the march and parts of the rally were great, this discussion is rediculous. The I more anti-athoritarian than thou crap has got to stop. The truck did suck ass though, with its stupid loud music drownding out the sweet dixi land band.
For all those now vowing to never work together again, I think you take yourselves too seriously. We need to make a movement to internally legalize Anarco-socialist love. Maybe if both sides could just attempt to not one up the other and make the other look bad while you make all of us look bad.
Someone asked why it was the same old crowd, because it was a rally for the people who were in it. That is, it was aimed to fit the needs of a certain group of "radical" folks, who all happen to dress alike.
Ideas for next time: Boston Marches and Rallys
31 Oct 2005
hey guys some good ideas and questions hidden in here, some very helpful.
well well well.
I'm thinking by April or May the snow and cold should give us a break - and Happy Halloween everybody, isnt this day lovely? :)

NEXT TIME: Women Black folk Latinos Asians and Youth should be FIRST CONSULTED as to what changes They/WE want done in this town which holds us down. White people if invited should be quite and listen, take notes, Learn From life's diversity and other wisdom.
THEN
The white people meet and *seriously self examine* thier own racism/ sexism/ homophobia/ agism yadda yadda yadda, and VOW to be mindful, watchful, and to call each other out on their crap.
THEN
Meeting with Woman and POC and youth again, bringing thoughts and open ears again, starting to work with POC and Women and Youth in leadership of the general direction as to what we do (breaking free from old paradimes is a plus: what about a supah secret spontainious Dance Party? or a mass street corner cleaning and political chalking? or a MA camp out with a dinner for the poor and hungry and homeless? or ,

ANYWAY, we talk creativity, Timing, Slots, etc. understanding that SHIT HAPPENS and organising ANYONE is like Hearding Cats: it cant be done easily logically and with total control, so sorry to any activists that want the trains to run on time ;) hee hee it aint gonna happen! Cause, this aint Germany!)

Oh yes: folks who contribute should NOT be operating under any old usuall capitalist expectation of REWARD like getting "a good speaker slot" or big truck, or being up front.

those are my ideas:
who wants to jopin and work with me - im picky, I dont allow bullshitters into my house, and I do not wimp out and feel that we have to work with everybody, or love everybody, in order to organize. aka I dont think I have to let white men have a big say in anything ever again for at least 300 years ;) hee hee

I mean, lets get over ourselves white folks: take a look around Boston: women and people of color are the majority here: we all learn to speak spanish learn chinese and learn how to be respectful when our mother earth is speaking, too.

Activists in "the left" need lo look at our own discourtisy and false "inbclusion" and learn from this.. for example, we may love the unemployed and disgruntled and disturbed as individul friends of ours, but they are not always the best leadership for organising a rally and march: we need ALL of us in the room...

and YES, that means kids from wellsley too!
I dont give a goodgoddamn where people were fortunate or unfortunate enougth to have been BORN - you cant HELP being born white, it just happenmed to you!: So ask, where is their MIND and HEART and how do they act?

by their actions you shall know em: and we can misinterpret thair actions too.. folks driving the truck might be sorry: lets ask em.

If you almost got hit, and you were frightened and angry: I'll say it: IM SORRY THAT HAPPENED TO YOU, thats NOT the way I would conduct business, and the driver should apologise to their fellow Human Beings.

The Youth Block ROCKED and showed up with the fearless vibrant beauty and the energy that we needed that day to survive the snow!! a

As an artist who worked very hard to bring ART to this rally and march, I salute YOU for coming and supporting in the snow, and I cried when I saw that support, and how uplifted our queer and gay and lesbian and trans sisters and brothers were by our support: AND THATS THE BEST DAMN THING WE DID IN THIS SAD LITTLE TOWN LATELY.

Love.
Peace.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
31 Oct 2005
wait Brezhnev, why do you keep saying we have anarcho-kerry politics? i am so baffled by that.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
31 Oct 2005
Yeah OK. It was a great rally and march. It should have happened earlier in the year, even though who could have predicted snow... The marching band rocked. The turnout was completely respectable--i have the video to prove it. People all over the political spectrum really do have to chill. Taking advantage of every opportunity to put other people down for whatever reason is a sign of your own frustration--lots of us are guilty of it now and then--we should all try to minimize it. People who insist on constant name-calling are likely trolls and should be ignored. Getting to know people outside of one's own group is a great thing to do at these gatherings--hopefully not everyone is there just fishing for new members. Finally, folks who are willing to meet each other and work together in good faith have every reason to be encouraged--there are lots of them (us) out there and we are just starting to connect and cooperate in earnest. Honestly--reading this list you might think we didn't pull off something pretty damn cool on saturday--believe that and the trolls have earned their pay. Until the next time, keep up your struggle, whatever it may be--and as with anything in life, making the effort to stay positive even when people around you suck is entirely worth it.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
31 Oct 2005
I think it is significant that certain people set up others of us to get arrested, when we were all marching together. And I disagree that just because we are all against the war that we should work together. While I agree that there should be more work across traditional anarchist/socialist lines (which is exactly what the Radical Youth Alliance is doing), I am not going to work with people who are going to set me up to be arrested. I've been talking to various people about Saturday, and one of them (who was in the youth bloc) pointed out that it was kind of fucked up that we just went to the front. And thinking back, I agree. However, if we are working together, if there is to be solidarity, y'all should say, "hey what you're doing is fucked up and here's why and here's what I think should happen". Setting us up to get arrested and separating us from the march is absolutely not acceptable. This isn't about holier-than-thou or competition, it's about the fact that what happened (not the entire protest obviously) was seriously fucked up.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
31 Oct 2005
eric, you're absolutely right--what happened with the separation is an issue that needs to be adressed, and the way to do that is that non answer folks are going to talk to any answer folk they see and find out what's up--if they're aware of the conflict, if they have their own story to tell, whatever, and they'll decide from those contacts who the people, if any, from that group they can maintain a dialogue with, wherby the issue can be cleared up, with people ending up not necessarily as friends, but with a slightly better way of adressing the issue, perhaps even while it's happening. the bottom line is that one major problem in our world today is that of trust. we've learned we can't trust the media OR our leaders. that leaves us in the position of having to hone our bullshit detectors in order to know if the exchange we're having with someone, whether online or in person, is "on the level" or whatever euphemism suits your need for assurance that someone is not jerking you around in some way. detecting bullshit, whether it be within your group or outside of it, is an art that needs to be encouraged. so does the availability of safe spaces for good faith exchanges between diverse groups. the conflicts being discussed on this thread are testament to the diversity of views that makes up the movement and that is a GOOD thing. if groups cannot and do not wish to work together that is their right and our responsibility to respect. however, let's not discard offhand the potential for very productive understandings to come to pass from these tumultuous festivals of engagement in truth-seeking.

faithfully in struggle,

...

ps bullshit detector - don't leave home without it! contact-CAUTION-confidence
DEC 4????
31 Oct 2005
didn't this whole scenario ALREADY HAPPEN a YEAR AGO?!
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
31 Oct 2005
do you have a link to the previous scenario? :)
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
31 Oct 2005
I'll gladly march alongside Communists to convey a certain message or attain a certain goal, but I won't march behind them. The holier-than-thou, elitist attitude which is presented in this thread is enough of an example as to why.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
01 Nov 2005
yes, it certainly is not holier than thou to demand to be in front of a protest.
The Truck
01 Nov 2005
How many miles per gallon did that truck get ? Think we could try something powered by bio-diesel next time around?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
01 Nov 2005
Quotes below from the very interesting article posted up in here called "No Justice and No Peace"

- lets discuss. This sort of thinking is why I wrote what I did here this am...

Building real group Unity in Boston, with TRUE DIVERSITY and RESPECT is so muuuuch more interesting to me than bitching about who may have tried to do what from a truck, or our party politics, or what street leaflet/booklets people might like to read, or who's cooler than who ;) !
-----------

"...As one of the main tools that is used in this country to address the government, street protest needs to be critically analyzed beyond an evaluation after each demonstration, with participants debating whether it was boring, dynamic, inspiring, or whatever.

Some of the questions that we ask instead are: What does it mean that organizers are compelled to use so much of their resources, in the name of social justice, to bus in people from across the U.S. and abroad, while half a million people here (DC), a majority of them the most disenfranchised in the country, continue to be ignored?

Does it make sense that the majority of people that travel to DC to “let their dissent be heard” are white, when the majority that lives in the city where they are protesting are people of color? And most importantly, what’s the point?

This is not to say that mass mobilizations are inherently pointless, rather, what is the larger strategic framework that they happen within, and also who makes the decisions about such frameworks and placing big protests as the priority? The many anti-globalization protests organized by the Mobilization for Global Justice exhibit this tendency, bringing thousands of protesters from around the country to demonstrate in downtown while not tapping the enormous resentment in the city towards the disenfranchisement of DC.

Similarly, the March for Women’s Lives in 2004 boasted of putting close to a million people on the streets, but again, the vast majority were white women, and even women organizers of color expressed dismay at the failure to better include them and their communities in the organizing and messaging.

DC has some of the worst indicators of reproductive health, from HIV and STD rates to high infant mortality, yet, black women from DC were never central to the demonstration.

Ironically, many of the organizers and “leaders” of these events ask the same question “why aren't there more black people here, they should care about this issue!" or “how do we get more people of color?” Clearly, there is a difference in how this issue is addressed, and we’d like to suggest that the problem lies less with “black people not caring” and more with the priorities, messages and outreach strategies deployed by those organizers.

Reliance on the Internet (as if a vast majority of people have regular access to it) and posters pasted haphazardly on light posts don’t count as grassroots organizing. In imagery and rhetoric, people in the global south are being used as the poster children to justify these mass mobilizations. Organizers of mostly white organizations say that they support marginalized people, but those people themselves are not centrally involved in the organizing.

So when you go to an anti-war march, you see Middle-eastern women and children propped up on poster board. When you go to an anti-globalization protest, you see the images of anguished faces of South and Central American families facing death squads. Perhaps when you walk down your street and see an advertisement for these protests, the ad has animated pictures of young folks of color holding paintbrushes set against a backdrop of phrases such as “We want our water back.” The implication here is that they have painted the slogans, graffiti style, in an act of resistance. But did they really? Or did someone use Photoshop to place the paintbrush in their hands and paste them against the white background with the words? Could there be a more classic case of white folks putting words in other peoples’ mouths?

So this is when we begin our talk about privilege, because attending mass mobilizations as the main form of resistance is a privilege. And it makes us wonder if people with certain privileges can cause that much change?

That topic would be a whole essay into itself, but we feel it is important to question the assumption that people with a high level of privilege are actually capable of giving most or all of it up for others, whom they may have a very tenuous connection to. Though that line of thought is very intriguing to us, we leave it for another time, and continue to consider the ways some are addressing their privilege...."
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
01 Nov 2005
Cindy gets the attention because she is exploiting the death of a hero who died trying to improve the lives of others. What makes it even more tragic is that she is the mother of this hero. Instead of standing behind and supporting her own son and the great cause that he believed in she is trashing his memory. That is much more important than half the junk on here. Does it really matter what a janitor gets paid? If you don't like the job, quit! Does it matter that a loud mouthed woman has no shame but to trash her son, his chosen profession or her country? Yes, it does.

You really and truly believe that intelligent people get paid to be "trolls" just because they disagree with you? Come on? Put the spy novel down and grow up. If not - where do I sign up to get paid? :)
Continue to support our brave men and woman in uniform!
To Wadoo
01 Nov 2005
Stop thinking you're so f*cking important. Do you honestly believe that the fbi has nothing else better to do than play mind games with you. Does the term "vissions of grandeur" mean anything to you ? COINTEL happened, no question. Yes, I read "Agents of Oppression" by Churchhill and Wall. But with government agencies so understaffed and underfunded, they probably don't have the time or money to fuc with you.
BTW, there are more than a few local vehicles that run on bio diesel or even vegatable oil mixes, remmeber the car at the Really, Really, Demoncratic Bazzar last year.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
01 Nov 2005
Hey, I agree with Amatul.

I think what it comes down to is whether we are struggling for the oppressed or with them, and whether we are willing to accept their leadership. POC have been working hard on anti-war issues here in Boston, in their own organizations. Fund the Dream, anti-J-ROTC stuff, anti-biolab organizing are some examples. This is because POC feel the impact of the war in their everyday lives--with their kids going off to war, with domestic spending cuts, with racist attacks, etc.

So it's funny when white people (of which I am one) come in and are like, "oh man, we need to organize a big protest to stop the war." Then they (we) attempt to "reach out" to communities of color by putting anti-racist things on flyers and getting some diverse speakers and seeking endorsements from certain people.

What we should have done in the first place was said, "hey we oppose this war, lets go talk to the communities that are most impacted by it (communities of color and poor white communities) and ask them how we can help them organize against it."

And I guarantee what would result would not be a series of disconnected protests with crowds that are over 90 percent white where we all pat ourselves on the back and then go home to our comfortable, disproportionately white communities and wait for the next big protest, but something on-going, with a little more strategy, and that produces more concrete results.

Same goes for the protests in DC. Why not ask folks there what they would like to see us do to aid their local stuggle? It's a basic organizing principle to have those most affected in leadership. Otherwise we often unintentionally contribute to the oppression we oppose.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
02 Nov 2005
You chose to lie down with the authoritarian dogs of your own volition and against the advice of older, more experiences anti-authoritarians. Hopefully, you will learn from the minor flea-bites you got this time around and not make the same mistake again.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
02 Nov 2005
Rudolfs a cop!
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
02 Nov 2005
thanks "k" - its good to know that someone besides a bunch of trolls actually reads this stuff.

Katt and Becca really deserved replys, from someone who worked a bit on this rally and march (I was on the Arts commitee - I dislike all that Roberts Rules boring agonising process stuff but I truely know all kindsa ART is much needed to touch the hearts and minds of humanity, and to amuse the public)

be well folks
keep up the good work

Peace and Love
its not a joke: its the only hope we have.
:)
#68 Sez
03 Nov 2005
Tell ya all something. Cindy Sheehan got heart. Doesn't give up. If all of us? And others who want this assinine war shut down? Were like her? We'd have OUR democracy.
Peace.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
03 Nov 2005
Just because the majority of the US population disagreed with any unilateral invasion of Iraq before the war and now over 60% want the troops home now and yet it still does not happen. This doesn't mean our democracy is dead, does it?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
03 Nov 2005
60 % of your world but not the real world. I'm guessing that you are unable to look at both sides of any issue. There is many different sites that state much different information than what is found on here. Speak with a 11B who just got home. He'll tell you something different.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
03 Nov 2005
As a member of the Boston IndyMedia collective who's been working with IndyMedia for several years now..... I can say with full confidence that what you read on Boston IndyMedia is not what you will read in the mainstream press or on the conservative right. To quote our mission statement, we are an organization "with the goal of providing an alternative to mass media, for-profit reporting." Also, the individuals and organizations who post to our website are encouraged to use our site to "facilitate political and cultural self-representation. We seek to illuminate and analyze issues impacting individuals, communities and eco-systems by providing media tools and knowledge to those seeking to communicate."

It is hardly surprising that you will find a progressive leftist philosophy in the content and comments to our articles. We have high hopes that the people who use our site will utalize the tool that we have provided to further their own understanding of and unity behind the left, and to act as a tool for individuals to gain a greater understanding of the differences of opinion on many common topics.
To: Michael Moore and the Far Left
03 Nov 2005
Who have you talked too Mike ? I can see S. Eppler's arguement about this being a forum that is progressively left, but some of stuff posted on IMC is absolutely false, which is also the case in the "corporate" media, which over "60%" of the population thinks is just right of Stalin (excluding Fox News). My point is, don't label everyone who disagrees with you as a "troll". Obviuosly some posters are "trolls", but others just have diferent ( and sometimes the correct) viewpoint. Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought dissent was allowed in a democracy.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
03 Nov 2005
Go here:
http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm

This poll shows most americans now think the war was a mistake. People on the left, which polls show by issue are the majority opposed this war from the begining. Rather than listening to the Radical right wing who were wrong, and who continue to mess up, maybe we should consult the people who were right from the begining?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
04 Nov 2005
She is not taking enough meds!
Her mouth has continued to bring shame to herself and her family. Her son is a hero and was doing a tough job that he and the rest of the country believed in.
RIP, Brother!
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
04 Nov 2005
As usual, things were a charlie foxtrot both at the march and on this web site. The petty complaints and whining are comical. Cindy running her mouth is also always good for a few laughs. I have heard that she has cleaned up her vocab so that is one positive thing. Meds must be finally working. Keep up the laughs!
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
04 Nov 2005
Cindy Sheehan...... Brought to you by Lily Pharmicutical.
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
09 Nov 2005
ATTENTION VETERAN!!!


Hello?
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
10 Nov 2005
Shush!
Re: Cindy Sheehan to Join Major Boston March and Rally to Bring the Troops Home
11 Nov 2005
NO!