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Announcement :: Organizing
March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
01 Feb 2006
On March through March 17 students from around the country will be demanding that the US pull its troops out of Iraq.
NATIONAL WEEK OF CAMPUS ACTION—Students Say NO to War in Iraq! College Not Combat, Troops Out Now!

Join Cindy Sheehan, Camilo Mejia, Kathy Kelly, and students who've fought repression and won at Berkeley, SFSU, CCNY, HCC, GMU, Kent State, Hampton, and Madison! On March 13-17th, students will hold events at high schools and colleges around the country demanding an immediate end to the occupation of Iraq and money for young people's education, not military recruitment. This week of action leads into the global days of protest on March 18-19, where students will join many others in marking the anniversary of the invasion of Iraq and demanding to bring the troops home now! (Spring break alternative: Schools on spring break during March 13-17 will hold events the week of March 20).

WHAT YOU CAN DO

Email RecruitersOut (at) yahoo.com to:

- Endorse this day of action

- If you're a student: let us know about an action being planned at
your school, or ask us to put you in touch with other students near you

- If you're an activist off-campus: Help organize massive protests on March 18-19. We will put you in touch with the anti-war student groups nearest you to facilitate grassroots coordination.

For more information, visit Campus Antiwar Network at http://www.campusantiwar.net

This work is in the public domain
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Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
01 Feb 2006
Hell, I'll support more money for education! Any time and any place!
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
01 Feb 2006
yet you support a president who cut school funding while thousands of schools are falling into disrepair and more and more low income and minority kids are failing due to such bullshit as the MCAS which is supported by his "No Child Left Behind"? do you have any idea the damage programs like that do to students and schools? but you haven't been in a public school in a while so you wouldn't know would you.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
01 Feb 2006
Careful what you say without first hand knowledge. When did I EVER say I supported the President of the United States. Not once! Whether I do or don't does not even matter. I do have the ability to respect the office and position. I had proper education and upbringing.......
Don't support the MCAS. DO you? Was in a public school today and have been quite often over the last few years. SO you were saying what? :)
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
01 Feb 2006
you arent a student. its a totally different experience. noah, why are you feeding the troll?
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
01 Feb 2006
Yeah, Veteran, your a grown up so you just wouldn't understand. Once you leave the safety and security of school and actually have to work for a living your views change, and you become a troll.

Once you start to lose promotionstoless qualified, less experienced, and undereducated minorities you get a whole new perspective on life.

Once you see 53% of your paycheck taken from you and given to 3rd and 4rth generation professional welfare families, and used to give criminal aliens free medical care while you pay $350 per month for medical care, you just don't understand.

Once the rose colored glasses find their way to the attic and the jesus slippers get tossed in the trash, once you stop wearing jeans with holes in them and bathe on a regular basis, you become a grown up, with sensible views, or in self loathing, kiddie pop culture... a troll.

Troll on!
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
01 Feb 2006
53% of your pay check, what county do you live in. Nobody pays 53% taxes.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
02 Feb 2006
What is that?
Been visiting many classrooms to talk and discuss certain topics that I have first hand knowledge of. This is backed with proof in the form of actual photographs and video. Imagine that. Truth! It's a beautiful thing. Not once have I offered the idea up that the military is the way to go. Not invited to promote the service, I'm invited to speak about my personal experiences.

I get a kick out of the troll thing. A troll is anyone that disagrees with the idea, even when supported by truth and evidence. So being a troll makes those that label the trolls close minded? Just curious.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
02 Feb 2006
I live in America, Brad. And 53% is probably 2-10% short of the actual number, but I'm a conservative and tend not to overstate the obvious.

My actual above the board marginal tax rate is 35%. Thats the federal income tax rate we are all most familiar with.

When I add in the hidden taxes that I pay on a daily basis (18% ultra-conservatively figured) I am satisfied with the 53% figure. Normal folks stop here, tax weenies read on.

Federal taxes today increase the cost of all products and services by between 20-35 percent, this is the "hidden tax" which I mention. State and local government taxes further raise that share to between 38-48 percent.

Keep in mind, these taxes are paid by all consumers and are in addition to the taxes we pay in income and payroll taxes already.

Brad, you are paying this 'hidden tax' on everything; services, food, clothing, shelter, appliances, vehicles, transportation, utilities, doctor's visits, prescription medicine, excise, firearms, alcohol, boats, Jose the lawn guy etc., etc., etc. On everything you buy. Even business-to-business transactions contain this added cost.

You get slammed by the hidden taxes hundreds or thousands of times a year every time you make a retail purchase. We pay these like ignorant unquestioning sheep and NEVER add them into what we consider "taxes".

Remember, businesses do not pay taxes, they pass these business expenses off to consumers by way of higher prices.

Now, get some paper and something to write with and do this simple exercise:
1.Write down your last year's before tax income.
2.Subtract how much you paid in taxes.
3.Next, subtract your total savings (410k, savings, etc.) The remainder should be what you spent last year.
4.Now, multiply that amount by 25% (the approximate hidden tax in everything).
5.Last, add that figure to the amount you thought was the total you paid in taxes last year, from #2 above. There is the actual amount you paid in federal taxes.

But remember, this does not even take into consideration state and local taxes, fees, property taxes, etc. Figure in those taxes and it's enough to make you sick.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
02 Feb 2006
oh no, taxes. It sure is terrible to have to contribute to the society I live in.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
02 Feb 2006
Presuming 53% of your wages to to tax, that hardly represents teh extent that goes to welfare programs much less the portion of that that is dubiously distributed.

See http://www.warresisters.org/piechart.htm this provied botht the "official" governement breakdown and an analysis of where military related expenses are hidden in other segments of the pie. The official figures place military spending at 19% the WRL places it at 48% read the figures and draw your own conclusion.

I'll grant that the welfare system does encourage abuse, I was encouraged to abuse it by people working in it, but that is a bit of a different issue and given the choice of paying a poor young person to be lazy or a poor you ng person to go kill other poor people I'll spend on lazy...
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
02 Feb 2006
First of all nobody bays over 33% federal income tax. That is the top tax bracket and you have to make a ton of money to pay that high amount. Most citizens pay 15-25% federal income tax. Next the tax on my groceries, clothing etc. is a local tax, not federal. Shelter tax, you mean property tax (if you rent you can actually deduct your rent). Jose does not pay taxes, JK. I get a tax rebate on my hybrid and I don't own any guns. All in all most citizens pay max 30-35% in total, inclucing local and state, taxes.

It is different in some countries like sweeden, where they do pay 50-60% tax. But they get free medical care, drugs, higher education, very good public transportation, high environmental standards and very low economic stratification. I think we should pay more, we both think corporations should pay more (or at least something). I also think taxing purchases is the most progressive way to tax. If you want more crap, you should pay more tax.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
02 Feb 2006
sales tax is regressive, the poorer you are the higher percentage of your income you pay in sales tax. It should be abolished.
.
02 Feb 2006
MaRK.jpg
hi
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
03 Feb 2006
Interesting off topic discussion. I'll be doing my taxes this weekend, and like most NOT looking forward to it. I would love to be able to keep on the money I earn yet we have been paying taxes forever. Don't like it, don't want to do it but it is part of our society so I'll do it and move on. Life is to short to be worried and whining all the time.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
03 Feb 2006
damnit why should i pay to subsidize arson, insurance scams, and irresponsible children with matches???

i'll take my chances with flames if it means i can save a buck or two.

what's with all these roads too? i don't need or want a car--dirt is good enough for me. why aren't roads built by taxing cars???
Do you see what I see?
03 Feb 2006
I think we should commit less money to education becase there are some people who don't have the capacity to learn or to think for themselves. No I am not a troll doll with rainbow hair, it just the facts, jack. Why do we fight over nothing worthwhile on this website? Taxes, fixing roads, people trying to lose weight by during the Walk for Hunger, calling this one a commi bastard, or your mom a whore. Are we that shortsighted? Everyone should be committed to as Dr.Phil calls our authentic self, and in our own lives we should fight battles that matter. Like being first in line at the check-out line. Opening the door for a weak person. Heck, filing taxes and not gripping about because you cheated on them any way. (I've never donated to chairty) Taking a bath each and every day, especially before going to a poli meeting. Hmm, what else, oh yeah, being thankful for the people around you, even if they are different. You never know, you may trip and fall on your face but maybe someone will appreciate your backside.
"you a big fine woman..."
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
04 Feb 2006
Everybody has to pay taxes for roads because it is for national security. Its true the highways were funded as national security. Of course it is ironic that they lead to massive sprawl, which increased our use of foriegn oil, which decreased our national security. Or did it? Once we rule the world we will be safe.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
05 Feb 2006
Maybe these students should say no to islamic extremists who:
Blow up buildings and people in them
Blow up pizza joints where teens hang out
Blow up weddings
Blow up funerals
Conduct sniper attacks at funerals
Riot and burn buildings because of cartoons
Torture women

THAT would be productive
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
06 Feb 2006
Van, do you mean US military?
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
06 Feb 2006
brad, your'e doing it again..........

Displaying your ignorance without having a clue as to what you are talking about.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
06 Feb 2006
Oh, so the US military has not blown up buildings in Iraq? It has not blown up weddings in Afganistan? It has not tortured women at Abu? It has not killed innocent civilians with snipers (think jounalists)?

Did I dream all of that? Do you know what you are talking about vet?
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
06 Feb 2006
Still chuckling at you.........

Speaking from my past experiences in the things you mentioned. Buildings that are used by enemy combatants or housing enemy combatants have been blown up. Been happening for hundreds of years. Does the US military intentionally blow up buildings for fun? NOPE! Does the US blow up buildings that may have innocent civilians inside? NOPE! Does the US blow up buildings that will cause possible death and destruction to surrounding areas? NOPE! NOT ON PURPOSE! Does it happen, yes it does. Is the loss of life tragically wrong? YES IT IS! Will it happen again? Yes, it will! If at all - there is another way - does the US military take that route first? YES, THEY DO! You honestly think that C-4 is the perferred way of dealing with an enemy combatant? You are sadly wrong. Let me also state - for the record - Untied States military is not in the practice of torturing, especially women. If it was happening it would be SPLASHED across the entire planet. You cannot hide that. You can easily fabricate it but you can't hide it. American men, especially those in the military, feel a higher sense of protection towards women than most others. One of the reasons they are not allowed in "combat MOS's".

What are you talking about? I think VAN, was referring to the constant and everday acts of senseless death brought to innocent civilians for no reason.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
06 Feb 2006
Brad...I would like you to give one example of a woman or anyone for that matter being tortured at abu garib.
torture at abu?
06 Feb 2006
There are pics.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
Silly Brad. A few months back someone posted pics on here that were SIXTEEN years old! They tried to associate them with current world events. Guess what happened when I pointed that out? They disappeared! :) Silly boy! :)
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
Vet, are you trying to say that the abu pics that were on every major news media were fake?
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
No grasshopper, I am saying that I have proven quite a few pics on here (military related) are fake or completely unrelated to what the author is discussing. Basically, misleading attempts to confuse those that are already lost. Being an intelligent person who likes to stay current on world events, I watch several news programs and missed the ones about the tortured women? Can you refresh my memory please? The torturing of women or harming of women is deplorable and no US soldier would stand by and let it happen. That type of abuse would have saturated the entire globe yet I missed it? Hmmm, I do rememebr a pic on here months back that showeed a female who looked like she had been abused but the picture was old and from Africa and from the 90's.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
PS - Is this aprt of your ten year quest of research on American domination or whatever little adventure your on? :)
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
Just do a simple search. There are plenty of pics of abuse at abu and Gitmo. There are also plenty of first hand accounts from prisners and even US soldiers confirming the abuse of women in US custody. The info is out there vet you just have to take of the blinders.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
Also, your condescending tone may intimidate others, but it does not work on me so you might as well be civil.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
Silly boy. Are you talking about the sub-standard trash that has already been sent to prison. England, Grangerer and the rest of that filth? Is that what this is about? I said it in the past and I'll say it again.........please listen this time.....US soldiers are the best trained, equipped, educated and lead military force on the planet. On top of that, EVERY single us service member has the right/ability to REFUSE any order that they feel is morally, ethically and humanely unlawful. SOOOOOOooooo, with that being said (again) those few that did any form of abuse, physical or emotional, were tried and put away. AS stated (again), US soldiers are not trained to torture, especially women!

MY PERSONAL OPINION (and those that serve honorably) - their punishment was to light. England and Granger should rot in jail for an additional twenty+ years.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
Um, Veteran, Janis Karpinski used to run that prison and she has testified that military intelligence was put in there without her knowledge. Those cases of "bad apples" just COINCIDENTALLY worked with that group from military intelligence. Their aim was to perform the abuse, take the pictures, release them to the world, and count on creating the extra terrorists needed to justify all their blather about the Islamofascist threat. Face it Veteran--you and your folk are toast. stop lying, confess, etc.

In fact, I'm putting a fork in this discussion, it is DONE!! :)) :)) :))

and we won.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
That is humorous, yet you believe it so it then goes from funny to sad and tragic.

You stated "Janis Karpinski used to run that prison and she has testified that military intelligence was put in there without her knowledge. Those cases of "bad apples" just COINCIDENTALLY worked with that group from military intelligence."

Are you kidding me? That is priceless fiction! You have no grasp of military MOS's, units. chain of command or factual events. I would have to say that you are done. Please step lively to the hippy van! :) Honestly, I am laughing at you!
Um, sure "Veteran"...
07 Feb 2006
Signal: To your knowledge, after Nov. 19, what were the instructions from Col. Pappas to MPs in the context of their involvement with interrogations?

Karpinski: To my knowledge there was none. He left it to the interrogation teams and the interrogators to tell the MPs what they needed them to do.

Signal: The statement of one of the civilian interrogators, Steve Stefanowicz, has been leaked to the press. It indicated that the interrogation teams would leave written instructions for MP guards. Do you have any personal knowledge of that kind of instruction?

Karpinski: No. And I will tell you that I find that doubtful, because I still would go through the prison facility, and I would drop in on the MPs at cellblock 1A or B or anywhere else at Abu Ghraib, and I'd look at their books, their SOPs, I'd ask them if there (were) any questions. I'd walk down the hallways and talk to some of the different detainees, and I never saw a set of instructions. I never saw written instructions from interrogators. I just didn't. And the MPs never told me that they had instructions from the interrogators. I do know that the interrogators told them verbally, because I read the Taguba report.

Signal: There has been talk about special "interrogation rules of engagement," which aren't out of the military playbook. Evidently, under these rules, if interrogators wanted to use particular techniques, they had to get the personal approval of Gen. Sanchez.

Karpinski: That's correct.

Signal: Did you see those "interrogation rules of engagement" posted on the walls at Abu Ghraib?

Karpinski: No, I did not. I never saw a list of rules for interrogators. When they said that they were posted on the walls, I said, what wall might they have been posted on? In the military intelligence operations office? Because they weren't posted in the cellblocks.

Signal: Col. Pappas has testified that those rules were developed as an outgrowth of Gen. Miller's visit in September. Do you have any knowledge of that?

Karpinski: Well, that would be consistent with what Gen. Miller said, that he was going to give them the instructions. But he talked about his interrogators, the ones that he was going to send up from Guantanamo Bay and the ones that he brought with him, that they knew what the rules were, and that they would share them with the interrogation team.


http://www.scvhistory.com/scvhistory/signal/iraq/sg070404.htm

SCV NEWSMAKER OF THE WEEK:
Brig. Gen. Janis Karpinski
Fmr. Commander, 800th Military Police Brigade

Interview by Leon Worden
Signal City Editor

Sunday, July 4, 2004
(Telephone interview conducted June 29, 2004)

**MEDIA—MANDATORY CREDIT: The Signal newspaper of Santa Clarita, Calif.
**OK to republish in whole or part for news purposes WITH CREDIT.
clarification
07 Feb 2006
that military intelligence was put in there without her knowledge

I did write that which is ambiguous--she knew military intelligence under general miller had been put in, but did not know what they were doing, did not oversee them, etc.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
If you really had a clue you would realize that you personally just wrecked your own claims. You are silly! That was funny!

PS - You seem to have little idea as to what military intelligence is or the term for it.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
I think you need to read more carefully, Vet.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
07 Feb 2006
Like most on here. You presume to think you have an idea of what you are speaking about. Your posts are funny! Keep them coming.
Dear Brad
07 Feb 2006
Dear Brad:
In answer to my request that you give me one example of a woman or any prisoner for that matter who was tortured at Abu Garab, you wrote:

"Just do a simple search. There are plenty of pics of abuse at abu and Gitmo. There are also plenty of first hand accounts from prisners and even US soldiers confirming the abuse of women in US custody."

Well, I did not ask for plenty of pics or plenty of examples. I asked for just ONE example of torture. Please just give me ONE example of TORTURE of a woman...or a man that you can substantiate.
))>TAGUUUUUBA<((
07 Feb 2006
below is from wikipedia citing the Taguba Report (leaked secret report of internal investigation) , but you can find the taguba report itself using scroogle.org

note it includes the raping of a female detainee by an mp



Taguba's report cited numerous examples of inmate abuse, including:

Punching, slapping, and kicking detainees; jumping on their naked feet.
Videotaping and photographing naked male and female detainees.
Forcibly arranging detainees in various sexually explicit positions for photographing.
Forcing detainees to remove their clothing and keeping them naked for several days at a time.
Forcing naked male detainees to wear women's underwear.
Forcing groups of male detainees to masturbate while being photographed and videotaped.
Arranging naked male detainees in a pile and then jumping on them.
Positioning a naked detainee on a MRE Box, with a sandbag on his head, and attaching wires to his fingers, toes, and penis to simulate electric torture.
A detainee forced to stand on boxesWriting "I am a Rapeist" [sic] on the leg of a detainee alleged to have raped a 15-year old fellow detainee, and then photographing him naked.
Placing a dog chain or strap around a naked detainee's neck and having a female soldier pose for a picture.
A male MP guard raping a female detainee.
Taking photographs of dead Iraqi detainees and MPs posing with cheerful looks.
Breaking chemical lights and pouring the phosphoric liquid on detainees.
Threatening detainees with a loaded 9mm pistol.
Pouring cold water on naked detainees.
Beating detainees with a broom handle and a chair.
Threatening male detainees with rape.
Allowing a military police guard to stitch the wound of a detainee who was injured after being slammed against the wall in his cell.
Sodomizing a detainee with a chemical light and perhaps a broom stick.
Using military working dogs (without muzzles) to frighten and intimidate detainees with threats of attack, and in one instance actually biting and severely injuring a detainee.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
The US military has hundreds of thousamds of great people that make it up. Sadly, like any big organization, there will always be a few pieces of trash that slipped through the system. Those dirtbags that DID abuse and humiliate prisoners have been put behind bars. I, and alot of other Veterans and serving members of the US military, feel that their sentences were to easy. They disgraced not just themselves and ther US military but the United States of America. They should rot for many, many more years. Additionally, there are a few others on trial right now as we speak who also acted outside the ROE or SOP's in regards to EPW's. They also should have the book thrown at them - several times over! The abuse and "torture" that you guys WANT to believe happens dailey does not. US military members are not trained and would not allow that to happen.
abuse of women
08 Feb 2006
ok, my bad. i think the private contractors Steve Stefanowicz and John Israel should share in the blame in the abu ghraib case though--it would be unfair to put all the blame on the enlistees.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
We all know why private contractors are hired--so that the army can't actually be blamed for the conduct of the bad apples they rent out. Sometimes a private company allows covert agents to use their company as a front. The Abu Ghraib abuse was intentionally designed to outrage muslim sensibilities, just like the "mohammed cartoons".

Again, this is to stoke the flames of hate and create terrorists that did not exist before in order to justify a response. This has been Israel's MO for a loooong time, and the lessons are not lost on Bush/PNAC.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
More assinine statements. Again, those few that participated or had knowledge of any violations of the ROE in regards to EPW's should be jailed for many, many years. Addiditionally, if civilian contractors were doing it and US soldiers stood around and did nothing...............disgraceful and would not have happened on my watch.

Bette, your statements are just plain ignorant. Let's see............As a former combat soldier would I rather deal peacefully with a group of people or fight them? That's quite easy. When Iwas speaking with a large group of sixth graders last week we were discussing an almost similar topic. They figured it out quicker than you!
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
Sorry Vet, but it's not the combat soldiers who want everyone to hate them, it's SOME of the higher ups, the ones who have their own agenda aligned with that of the Israeli right wing. And I know that you know that lots of soldiers know exactly what's going on.

I think you're too accustomed to dealing with grade-schoolers.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
Your statements are ignorant and assisine. Agendas are to complete the mission and bring everyone home safely. You cannot really make intelligent comments because you have no knowledge of the topic.

Actually, I have been asked to present to hundreds of kids each year ranging from 6th to 12th grade. I'll be doing it again in a few weeks. Kids need honest and accurate information presented by people who have been there done that.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
ASININE

one S

ps thanks for coming and lying to the children about their country!
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
I always get a chuckle from the Missus' telling me about Veteran's talks to the kids. Especially when he brings in the Islamofascist puppets to illustrate the methods used by the military to soften up detainees!!
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
You guys are the best!

So by sharing my experiences that is wrong? Interesting/ignorant way of thinking you got there. Also, lies are not shared or told. You clowns remind me of a college professor I had last year. Did you hear that story from me?

Did a presentation (military related) that involved my experiences backed up with OTHER first hand accounts, PICTURES and a 50 minute video of the actual events I was talking about. Thsi idiot professor said it was lies. My entire class, made up of students over the age of 25, literally and honestly fell out of their chairs laughing at this fool. It was priceless! We had so much fun with this blind professor after that. He doesn't teachthat course anymore! :)

So, you are not alone, there are others, not many, but there are others who also don't have the ability to understand truth.

PS - Was just chatting with a good friend of mine. He is heading to Iraq very soon. I passed on this web site to him, and he'll pass it on to his platoon, so we can get some more truth out in the open! Semper Fi, brother!
can anyone decipher the last post?
08 Feb 2006
I'm not sure what the brother is getting at...
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
Some have a hard time accepting the truth. They'd rather believe their "boogey men" are real and evil and that they are right and everyone else is wrong - even when presented with the truth.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
Vet, your solipsistic veiw does not make up the totality of the truth. Although you are a very wise and experienced person there may be things that happen in the world that are beyond your personal experiences.

"The truth is the whole." Hegel
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
I am well aware that my part in anything on this planet is NOT the whole truth. Never claimed that to be the case. I only discuss and share knowledge about the events that I have personally endured and been an active part in.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
No vet, you claim to hold the truth. Look back at your comments. Anyone that questions you gets the "you are unable to accept the truth" line.
to veteran
08 Feb 2006
veteran did you hear about the house that got blown up killing 12 civillians because an unmanned drone saw some people dig a hole and then go to that house?
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
No, you look back.

When fools state that American military members are trained in torture I speak up. They are not. When it says American military members are forced to do things. I speak up for they are not. I was never trained in torture. I was never forced to do anything. When fools state American military members are heartless killers I speak up. They are not. No one wants to fight but everyone of them wants to help those that need it. I DID exercise my ability to disobey an order that I thought was unlawful not once but twice. Imagine that!
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
08 Feb 2006
Again Vet I am sorry but you do not know what you are talking about. Soldiers are most defiantly trained in torture techniques (as defined by geneva conv. not Gonzales). Just because you weren't does not mean none were. You do not know all that goes on in the military. Many soldiers have come out to state this.

Now you will call me stupid and say that I don't know anything about it. This is your modus opp. You are always right and everyone else is always wrong.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
09 Feb 2006
Silly Brad, no need to call you stupid. I think you might be starting to see the light.....
You have no first hand knowledge of what you are spewing out. Also, I think I may have mentioned it in the past BUT US soldiers are required to attend training on the Geneva Convention as well as the Rules of Land Warfare every single year. The only time torture is mentioned is when we were instructed that it would NOT be tolerated and would be punished under the UCMJ and anything else that could be thrown at the offender. Also, having served in a few rapid deployment units (the "tip of the spear") we were trained in pretty much everything. Lastly, I never denied that it hasn't happened because it has. In every HUGE group of individuals there is always a few loose screws. That cannot be helped. It sucks that it has happened and those that did it will/are paying for it. The ideas that you have floating around in your head of mass torture in deep dark caves by US soldiers does not happen. 99.9 % of the soldier would not tolerate it and would use every means at their disposal to stop it. I know you might have a hard time dealing with it but its the truth.
Re: March 13 - 17, Students say no to war
09 Feb 2006
I can back up what I know because I have been there. I don't lie to you. I have no need to. I have no agenda. I have no reason other than telling the truth. I'm not sugar coating anything, I'm not promoting anything. I just type what I know is the truth. I am not trying to sway you, convert you or get you to buy me a beer. I have actually been to the places you comment on. I have served with the people you comment about. I don't come here to do anything else than explain the side that is not allowed to be explained on here. You feel that you are right due to ten years of research. You are entitled to that. I know I am am right due to ten years of living it.